Free to play

[mortal Offline]

Will the game be free to play or will there be a one time charge or a monthly subscription?

[pgf developer Online]

First we consider a P2P system.

B2P is less preferred, but possible.

F2P — only if there are no other ways. But this is unlikely to happen.

This problem is not solved still.

Наша сила не только в когтях и живучести. Наша сила в свободе и чести.

[community manager Offline]

I for one don’t enjoy f2p due to it usually turning into a cash-grab for the company and all content becomes watered down and reskins of outfits, etc and the developers (on past games) become lazy.

"We will be relentless in our pursuit for perfection. We won't ever be perfect - but in the process we will achieve greatness." - Vince Lombardi

[mortal Offline]

I could see it being a B2P model with games like Guild Wars 1 and 2 or the reclassified ESO as good examples, or a P2P model which would provide the developers with the stream of revenue they need to keep developing and in turn provide us the players with the content we want like small and large content expansions.

"The blood of the ancients are coursing through my veins, the blood from a being man has never known, I am the one who cannot die, I am the the killer for all time..."

[mortal Offline]

I hope it will be b2p.
If it starts with p2p it will eventually turn to b2p.Like nearly all mmorpg realesed these times.

[pgf developer Online]

FurkanCetin said:

I hope it will be b2p.
If it starts with p2p it will eventually turn to b2p.Like nearly all mmorpg realesed these times.

You must understand that b2p will not save you from limitations within the game and from further and probably unforeseen costs in the future.

Наша сила не только в когтях и живучести. Наша сила в свободе и чести.

[mortal Offline]

As an adult who is a wage earner, 15-20$ usd a month is nothing for the mere entertainment and i’m quite happy to pay it. There are also advantages to this model as compared to the other two.

That being said, if i’m paying 15-20$ usd a month I require the game to keep me entertained. Low replay, low amount of in game things to do, unresponsive developers (which so far has been far from the case), lackluster content updates etc are all reasons I would cancel my subscription.

[community manager Offline]

lethargic said:

As an adult who is a wage earner, 15-20$ usd a month is nothing for the mere entertainment and i’m quite happy to pay it. There are also advantages to this model as compared to the other two.

That being said, if i’m paying 15-20$ usd a month I require the game to keep me entertained. Low replay, low amount of in game things to do, unresponsive developers (which so far has been far from the case), lackluster content updates etc are all reasons I would cancel my subscription.

You hit the nail on the head Lethargic. That said, it’s one of the #1 issues with games/developers these days. The community doesn’t feel important, and that is the worst thing you can do for a games revenue. Aside from lack-luster content, no content updates and lazy reskinned-rehashing of things already in the game and trying to call it «new content».

"We will be relentless in our pursuit for perfection. We won't ever be perfect - but in the process we will achieve greatness." - Vince Lombardi

[mortal Offline]

While I was ready to pay any price for playing WoD, even if it would be subscription based, I must say that I’d prefer that this game would be B2P. Currently most of the game developing companies are no longer trustworthy due to their cashmaking strategy and rushing toward releasing product that is not even finished or … cancelling the projects (Screw you CCP). DLCs and other moneysucking tricks makes me think more than twice about purchasing a game. Also, sadly some of the biggest subscription based titles have item shops in addition to monthly fee. I am all against F2P since free games are attracting mostly young and immature players who are spoiling the fun for others. Such games also usually are P2W with rich item shops and other crap that put non-paying players at great disadvantage. Game like Guild Wars [2] is doing fine with B2P model, I belive Project Dogmat would do too. 

[pgf developer Online]

You have heard that Guild Wars 2 makes players pay for the game again to get a new update? For many this is quite a lot of money.

Наша сила не только в когтях и живучести. Наша сила в свободе и чести.

[mortal Offline]

Really? Oh well, just one more for the blacklist. I didn’t play it for some time and I wanted to come back, but now I don’t. I really miss the times when games were more about the games, not cashgrabbing. I will hold my ground even stronger. I want to pay for the game once and be happy to play it anytime with a comfort that I won’t be forced to pay more for it, or that my character will be deleted (that really happened). 

[pgf developer Online]

It is normal practice for B2P games. You buy the game, play for a while… But sooner or later they will still require you to pay more. And if you do not, then do not get access to new content.

Наша сила не только в когтях и живучести. Наша сила в свободе и чести.

[mortal Offline]

As long as by ‘new content’ you mean new expansion packs I’m ok with that. 

[mortal Offline]

I think the P2P method would be good for a game like this.  I do think it should be on the lower scale of monthly payments however to keep from scaring people off.  Something around $10USD monthly would be a reasonable price for most I would think.

[mortal Offline]

I do believe that P2P would be the best option, as long as there are NO microtransactions/item shops at all.

[mortal Offline]

As someone with not much money because london is fucking expensive
I would prefer it if you could just buy the game and be able to play without having to pay each month but I am probably in the minority either way I will back your kickstarter .

[mortal Offline]

Fuck Free to play , Fuck Buy to play , both suck pretty bad. If you want quality you
have to be willing to pay for it !!! A monthly subscription is the only way for a mmo to keep
its high quality and add new interesting content without becoming pay to win.Also don’t even dare
to add micro-transactions , I prefer a higher monthly fee than this shit

[mortal Offline]

I’m ok with P2P provided the subscription is a reasonable price (nothing worse then paying through the nose and not recieving sufficient return for it),

perhaps consider the B2P with premium P2P perk option?

B2P and play for ever but do so at base rates for XP/Gold aquisition, P2P premium mode for access to increased XP/Gold aquisition …. with future expansions etc as B2P DLC’s

[mortal Offline]

@Chronocidal I think that is the best option .
I feel that perhaps people would be more open to a yearly fee than a monthly fee if Chronocidal’s solution isn’t viable .

[mortal Offline]

thanks …

I’m not sure if other games use any similiar methods but my suggestion was a twist on the «freemium» method,

after all I’m sure we all want the developers to make cash with the game, as long as its profitable then we the future players get new content along the way rather then having to replay the same stuff endlessly for years,

this way those who want to spend the cash can and those who cant dont «have to» … its a «pay not to grind» option that isnt the same as «pay to win»,

unfortunately of course the B2P DLC expansion concept does mean that some will complain about «pay walls» since such content would be «locked out» for those who dont buy the DLC … but even that can be mitigated by the inclusion of some content in each expansion being availible to existing B2P players,

for example :-

expansion comes out and contains (using typical MMO examples)… new level cap, new race, new classes(?), new weapons, new maps,  and new dungeons

of these the new maps, new level cap and any new weapons that are allowed to existing classes(?) is availible to existing players but everything else is «locked» until the player purchases the DLC,

this way existing B2P players get a little something to keep them interested and playing, while at the same time we encourage the purchase of the new «locked» content

[mortal Offline]

Chronocidal said:

thanks …

I’m not sure if other games use any similiar methods but my suggestion was a twist on the «freemium» method,

after all I’m sure we all want the developers to make cash with the game, as long as its profitable then we the future players get new content along the way rather then having to replay the same stuff endlessly for years,

this way those who want to spend the cash can and those who cant dont «have to» … its a «pay not to grind» option that isnt the same as «pay to win»,

unfortunately of course the B2P DLC expansion concept does mean that some will complain about «pay walls» since such content would be «locked out» for those who dont buy the DLC … but even that can be mitigated by the inclusion of some content in each expansion being availible to existing B2P players,

for example :-

expansion comes out and contains (using typical MMO examples)… new level cap, new race, new classes(?), new weapons, new maps,  and new dungeons

of these the new maps, new level cap and any new weapons that are allowed to existing classes(?) is availible to existing players but everything else is «locked» until the player purchases the DLC,

this way existing B2P players get a little something to keep them interested and playing, while at the same time we encourage the purchase of the new «locked» content

If that happens I wont bother with Project Dogmat anymore
Free to Play ( your freemium is included ) guarantees lots of retarded kids + low quality + Pay to win.
Pay not to grind is NEVER ENOUGH !!! Pay not to grind works only in LOL and thats moba and not even close
to the complexity of a mmo

[mortal Offline]

Crimson_Ghost said:

I do believe that P2P would be the best option, as long as there are NO microtransactions/item shops at all.

Totally agree with you

[mortal Offline]

anyway .. as others have said above,

subscription games are on the decrease, most have gone with either B2P payment models or even (shudder) F2P,

and if dogmat wants to be popular enough to be successful then following current gaming payment trends cant be a bad idea … catering exclusively to a dwindling breed of gamers (P2P’ers) is almost asking for a smaller population then might otherwise be achieved,

combining B2P with P2P would be a better solution and ensure a larger population while still avoiding the F2P hordes

[mortal Offline]

Chronocidal said:

anyway .. as others have said above,

subscription games are on the decrease, most have gone with either B2P payment models or even (shudder) F2P,

and if dogmat wants to be popular enough to be successful then following current gaming payment trends cant be a bad idea … catering exclusively to a dwindling breed of gamers (P2P’ers) is almost asking for a smaller population then might otherwise be achieved,

combining B2P with P2P would be a better solution and ensure a larger population while still avoiding the F2P hordes

All B2P and F2P games are boring and dont offer anything new, since wow every mmo was shitty copy of it, no original ideas at all. Also the genre of Project Dogmat is a NICHE genre, not for your average joe . I think Project dogmat should look at Camelot Unchained and see what they are doing.I think it would be better to aim for 10.000 — 100.000 dedicated players instead of going for the big masses who will try the game for a while and then let it to rot like so many other mmos these days.I mentioned Camelot Unchained because its a very successful kickstarter mmo thats in Alpha right now and have many similarities with Project Dogmat like the fact that both are niche mmos, both are kickstaster and both try implement something new for change at the respective genres.Moreover I think the developers should listen to their backers, they ones that will actually give them money not the free to play casuals that are
a menace for the quality of modern mmos

[mortal Offline]

Im totally agree with Gangrel. With pay to play the Prelude Factory receive money for salary, server administration and for future expansions. We receive in exchange a good quality and 14 years-old-free gothic game. Im curios about the fee( im currently unemployed and this…suck :(( )